seachem discuss buffer

[harbour151]

I just purchased seachem's discuss buffer and I would like to start off by saying that you need way more information on a product that is so potentially harmful!!!!!!!!!

Here are some of my questions that I need to know before I attempt to use this in my aquarium.

I use a 50/50 mix of RO and Tap, this gives me a KH of 60mg/L , a GH of 100mg/L and a PH of 7.8 to 8.

Will this product lower my KH anymore than it is already?

What other parameters willl this product effect other than the ovious......phosphate?

Do you have any recommendations after seeing my current water conditions

and finally is this the product that I should be using??

Through me a bone here!!!!

Harbour151

[Tech Support RB]

There may be some confusion as to what type of buffering system you currently have and what type you are trying to achieve. There are 2 types of buffering systems relied on in freshwater systems: 1) bicarbonate based buffering systems referred to as KH (KH is a type of alkalinity) and 2) phosphate based buffering systems (these phosphate based buffers will build phosphate based alkalinity). Of the 2, phosphate based buffering systems, achieved with products like our Discus Buffer and Neutral Regulator, tend to be more stable in the long run as they are not as easily influenced by acids. They also have the added benefit of softening water by precipitating calcium and magnesium (measured as GH) out of solution which is great for discus as they prefer soft water. Those are some reasons why phosphate based buffers have been used for many years in this hobby and are often preferred.

You mentioned that your water tested at a KH of 60 mg/l. After using Discus Buffer in an aquarium or in make up water, your alkalinity will increase as you are adding a phosphate based buffer in essence building phosphate based alkalinity. Since you are increasing alkalinity, this should show as an increase on your KH test kit. Keep in mind that KH test kits can not distinguish between the different types of alkalinity......so you can not determine how much of your alkalinity is KH and how much is phosphate with a conventional KH test kit. The blend of phosphate based salts in Discus Buffer has a pK of around 5.0. PK is a term used to represent where the resulting pH of a buffering system will be it's strongest. For example, our Neutral Regulator is a phosphate based buffer that has a pK of 7.0, so it preferentially buffers at a pH of 7.0. Given this, the more you use Discus Buffer the more you will increase your alkalinity with a buffer that brings your pH down with each use (it will take multiple doses of this buffer to eventually get to 5.0). Using Neutral Regulator and Discus Buffer together can help in tailoring your aquarium's buffering system to your specific needs in adjusting pH anywhere between 5.0 - 7.0.

In order to set up a phosphate based buffering system in an aquarium that already has a built in KH based buffering system from source water like yours does, you will need to either 1) use enough phosphate based buffer to out compete your existing KH based buffering system. Keep in mind that it could take more than 1 dose of a phosphate based buffer to achieve your desired pH in the situation of out competing an existing KH. Or 2) use an acid like our Acid Buffer to dissolve your KH first. Our Acid Buffer dissolves KH converting into CO2 and will gas off. Once your KH is removed (gassed off), you can easily set up a phosphate based buffer.

Regarding your specific questions;
- This product is not harmful. In fact it is very helpful in maintaining pH as it is a very stable pH buffer and also has the added benefit of softening water.
- This product will not affect KH alkalinity, in fact it will increase phosphate based alkalinity.
- Affected parameters are lowered pH, increased phosphate based alkalinity and softened water (lowered GH).
- If you opt for a KH based buffering system, which is preferred in FW planted aquariums, I suggest using our Alkaline Buffer and Acid Buffer to help establish and adjust KH and pH as needed.

Hope this helps! If you need any further explanation or clarification, please respond in kind. You can also send me a PM or call toll free, 888-SEACHEM, at your convenience 9 - 5 EST.

[harbour151]

Thanks for the quick reply!

That helped answer alot of questions. You said that I could use an acid based buffer and gas off all of my existing KH. Won't this cause my PH to crash? If so will the addition of the phosphate buffer bring the PH up, and will it be all that I will have to add back into the water?

Thanks again, and sorrry for all the question, just don't want to mess anything up.

[Tech Support RB]

If you are considering using Acid Buffer to dissolve your KH prior to establishing a phosphate based buffering system, you can do so ahead of time in a container of water to be used for partial water exchanges or directly in the aquarium. I personally find it easier to do so ahead of time. If it is possible to adjust water ahead of time, dose the Acid Buffer to that water to dissolve your KH converting it into CO2 gas. CO2 in water forms carbonic acid. Now all you have to do is put an air stone in that container for a few hours (maybe even up to a day) to gas off that CO2, in essence gassing of a source of acid (carbonic acid), and your pH will rise. Now that you have dissolved your KH into CO2 and forced the gas out, you can use the fixed ratios of our Discus Buffer to Neutral Regulator to target an exact pH by following the ratios on the back label of Discus Buffer. If you opt to dose Acid Buffer to your aquarium, simply follow the recommended dosing instructions on the label. The recommended dose of this product is minimal as to not encourage a pH crash. After dosing Acid Buffer, check pH in 24 hours to see if further adjustment is needed. After adjusting the pH in your aquarium to the desired level, then use the method of adjusting pH in make up water mentioned above. Example, let's say you desire a pH of 6.5. You have also adjusted the pH in your aquarium to 6.5 with a stable phosphate based buffer. When you perform a partial water exchange, you will be exchanging water that has a pH of 6.5 for water that was previously adjusted to a pH of 6.5 with a stable phosphate based buffer. This is ideal. You also have the ability to heat the water in that container to the desired temp with a submersible aquarium heater if needed ahead of time. Please respond if you need any further assistance.